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Thread: Holy Crap .... a review around here that got rated a 5 outta 10 (Intuition)

  1. #21


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    Yeah, but this reviewer in particular isn't just an apop/VNV/ebm fan - he was obviously familiar with other stuff (he knew the work of the Echoing Green, for example) and he's reviewed plenty of other stuff of varying types. Really, the stretch between futurepoppy stuff and "lighter" synthpop isn't all that far (Echo Image, for example). It's really *not* like any one of us reviewing a country album. We're getting down to subgenre nitpicking - it's not quite but almost to the point where we're accusing the reiviewr of being unfair because the album cover was a royla blue and the reviewer really prefers indigo.

    Who reviews an album is pretty much the luck of the draw. We, for example, had a fair number of fans in the Side-Line office, but the guy who fished our album off the pile for the review wasn't one of them and really didn't like it. That's just the way it goes.
    Eric Oehler
    wonko@nulldevice.com
    www.nulldevice.com

  2. #22
    Lead ElectroGardener NoirTech's Avatar
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    What I was trying to get at is that this album is beyond what we call synthpop. In my opinion...once again...it is playing in a different level then any of the bands the guy has reviewed in the past.
    ------------------------------
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  3. #23


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    Huh. Well, I haven't heard the album, so I can't really judge that.

    I'd think then that the review of Peter Gabriel's "Up" on the website then must be totally off-base, then. That's certainly beyond synthpop.
    Eric Oehler
    wonko@nulldevice.com
    www.nulldevice.com

  4. #24


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    I give "Up" an 8.

    Brian.

    11th Records Mastering
    www.11threcords.com

    Color Theory
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  5. #25
    Lead ElectroGardener NoirTech's Avatar
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    Originally posted by NullDevice
    Huh. Well, I haven't heard the album, so I can't really judge that.

    I'd think then that the review of Peter Gabriel's "Up" on the website then must be totally off-base, then. That's certainly beyond synthpop.
    What can I say. Mark really loves Peter Garbriel. He was telling me he was going to post a review of that album before he did, and I thought it was great that we would start getting other type of music review up there. Maybe I should submit a 50 Cent review. :-)



    I'm obviously kidding about the 50 Cent review.....(or am I?)
    ------------------------------
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  6. #26


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    Forget the Intuition album, you guys HAVE to hear the new Canibal Corpse album! Perfect for an evening away with your sweetheart.

  7. #27
    Lead ElectroGardener cliffwalk's Avatar
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    Originally posted by garrett
    Forget the Intuition album, you guys HAVE to hear the new Canibal Corpse album! Perfect for an evening away with your sweetheart.
    *ROFLMAO*

    If you\'re reading this, you have a tiny penis.

  8. #28


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    Iew. Makes me just want to run out and buy it.

    And grab a snack, for that matter. Not.

    I stick by what I said before. It's not one review that counts. It's the number of reviews. One review doesn't help you. Twenty reviews helps a lot, even if half of them are negative.
    ====
    DAVID VESEL -- synthetic music for humans
    On the Electrogarden Network
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    Your mileage may vary.

  9. #29


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    I must admit to being totally gobsmacked that one negative review has raised so much controversy. It was me who reviewed the Intuition album & despite my negative comments I did mention that many synthpop fans would like it & in all my opinions I made sure it was clear that this was only my take on the album & that I fully expected some people to disagree with me.
    As to why I reviewed the album, I did so because Todd Durrant sent me a copy for this reason. I have been reviewing ADD releases for 6 years or so now so Todd obviously knows that I can put aside my personal likes & dislikes to a certain extent when reviewing, I've spoken with him on this subject & he is OK about it. Just because I disliked this album does not make me a synthpop hater as I have favourably reviewed artists such as The Echoing Green, Color Theory, Empire State Human, Freezepop, Nukleon, Gary Flanagan & Seven Words in the past (not all on EGN but other places too) & enjoy listening to all these bands as well as EBM & so on. I do feel qualified to review the album as my tastes stretch beyond these genres to instrumental electronic music & even Hawkwind & Ozric Tentacles!! At no point did I say I expected Intuition to be the new Mesh or VNV & did not base my review from this viewpoint, I simply thought it lacked feeling & heart, this is a comment about this album, not all synthpop, although 'dark' might have been the wrong adjective to use when describing what I hoped "Bleed" might be like, "gritty" would have been better.
    At the end of the day I stand by what I said about the album even if I have attracted a lot of flak for it. I am pleased that a lot of people have enjoyed it & are getting into the band. Still, at least people are talking & debating which can only be a good thing.

  10. #30
    Lead ElectroGardener cliffwalk's Avatar
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    Originally posted by carlj
    At the end of the day I stand by what I said about the album even if I have attracted a lot of flak for it. I am pleased that a lot of people have enjoyed it & are getting into the band. Still, at least people are talking & debating which can only be a good thing.
    This is reassuring to read. I think what this thread shows to me is that one thing our little "community" needs to be careful about/congnizant of is consistency and integrity. To keep the bar high for the artists as well as to continue expanding the listener's experience we need to continually up the bar as well as simply exercise our ability to critically think.

    That was my whole complaint to begin with. If there's what appears to be a rather "skewed" set of ratings NOW then maybe we just want to resolve to invest the time in giving more useful critiques. That process builds better music.

    Dave
    If you\'re reading this, you have a tiny penis.

  11. #31


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    Originally posted by carlj
    I simply thought it lacked feeling & heart, this is a comment about this album, not all synthpop, although 'dark' might have been the wrong adjective to use when describing what I hoped "Bleed" might be like, "gritty" would have been better.
    To me this comment is absurd. In my opinion Further has a lot of feeling and heart, and with Iris it is the best album of the year so far. Bleed to be more gritty? Come on, it's a ballad/love song, why should it be more gritty? Of course like people said before tastes are different.

  12. #32


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    See, these are opinions. And a reviewer should have them, what with that being his job and all. They're not "wrong" or "right" they just "are." You may not agree with it, but that doesn't make it wrong.

    For example, a ballad/love song can sound gritty - there are plenty of very "gritty" ballads out there. And he thought that perhaps this one would've been better served had it been of that style, based on lyrical and/or musical content. That's his opinion, and it doesn't agree with yours. That doesn't make the assessment unfair or absurd.

    Maybe Further connected with you. But since everybody has different experiences, tastes, etc, it may not have connected with Carl on the same level. Since I generally have agreed with his taste in music, reading the review would tell a person like me that hey, maybe Intuition isn't my speed. That doesn't make it a bad album. It just means that it's probably not my taste, even though it's yours.

    So, what, he should just blindly give it a good review so I can go out and buy it and be dissatisfied? The only people "qualified" to do a music review are people that will like what they're given? Would you do that with a movie? A hip-hop record? Why is a synthpop reviewer being held to different standards? Is Roger Ebert unqualified becuse he panned "Cabin Boy"; becasue he doesn't normally like Chris Elliot movies?

    Really, there're a few things wrong with this whole discussion. The whole concept of a review is subjective, and people are acting like it's some sort of objective discussion that is just wrong. People are accusing him of being "unqualified" to review the album - but what, exactly, makes {you} qualified to meta-review the review? {Your} opinions on the review would be biased by your feelings on the album, which is exactly the same sort of bias he's being accused of. (I'm about a step away from trying to prove the fallacy of the argument using boolean algebra)

    And reading the review over and over again, it's not a bad review. If he'd given a score of "8" but written the same dang thing, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

    Personally I think EGN should have mroe reviews of non-synthpop releases...I'm sure there's more than 3 or 4 of us who listen to things *other* than bleeps and sweeps.
    Eric Oehler
    wonko@nulldevice.com
    www.nulldevice.com

  13. #33
    Lead ElectroGardener NoirTech's Avatar
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    Originally posted by NullDevice

    Personally I think EGN should have mroe reviews of non-synthpop releases...I'm sure there's more than 3 or 4 of us who listen to things *other* than bleeps and sweeps.
    THIS, I agree with.
    Time to expand.
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  14. #34
    Lead ElectroGardener cliffwalk's Avatar
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    Originally posted by NoirTech


    THIS, I agree with.
    Time to expand.
    In the interest of stealing yet another post for accumulation sake I'm going to throw in "ME TOO".

    I mean the focus of this site is on Electronics so there should be boundaries but, for instance, David Sylvian just released a new album. It's a series of pieces of Acoustic Guitar and Electronics.

    Not really synthpop but I bet a review of it would interest more than just me. And that's the tip.

    Also, there's a whole world of hybrid styles... again, that doesn't fall into the standard 80s synthpop genre that I'D LOVE to read reviews and news about ...

    This is one of those consensus things. My interest on here isn't because of the standard defined "synthpop". It's because of SYNTHESIZERS. Electronic music/Synthesizers are one of many musical interests of mine.

    Hell, if Vangelis and Jon Anderson released another album together I'd love to read a review on that.

    Rick Wakeman, Keith Emerson, Ryuiki Sakamoto, Brian Eno, Trevor Horn, Geoffrey Downes and the list goes on...etc.

    Dave
    If you\'re reading this, you have a tiny penis.

  15. #35
    Lead ElectroGardener NoirTech's Avatar
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    Yes! Also, ... movie scores CDs would be great to hear reviews from. For example,...the Gladiator music score soundtrack. I just love listening to this soundtrack a lot. Hans Zimmer is a freaking genius, in my opinion of course. :-)
    That soundtrack just gives me goose bumps everytime I listen to it.
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